Voltage Talk Forum Home Page Voltage Talk Forum Home Page    National Low Voltage Contractors Association Home Page
Go Back   VoltageTalk.com > Specialties > Security, Alarm Systems
Search Voltage Talk          
 
Forgot Login Information    Problem Logging In?

“CLICK HERE AND JOIN OUR COMMUNITY TODAY...IT'S FREE!”

Register Here Search Recent Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 04-25-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
colsec_tech colsec_tech is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 4
Rep Power: 0
colsec_tech is on a distinguished road
Post Monitoring and our obligation

Customer calls to complain:

Customer - Someone broke into my house this past weekend while I was off on vacation and I was not notified. The neighbors said that the siren was sounding, but I did not receive a call from the monitoring station.

I would like to hear some of your thought out answers to this question. I had one lady claim that she was going to sue us for her stolen property, then when I explained to her that her phone company had disconnected the phones to the alarm panel from the IP box (and plugged her cordless phone directly to it) she claimed she would sue them. They also told her this would not affect her alarm system. Don't you just love the ongoing love between the alarm company and the telephone company?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-26-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
CarlAshcraft CarlAshcraft is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Orlando, FL
Posts: 171
Rep Power: 9
CarlAshcraft is on a distinguished road
Default

I would assume it is all based upon what your contract with the customer states. Also, do you have the alarm panel setup for a monthly test?
__________________
Carl Ashcraft
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-26-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
Security101's Avatar
Security101 Security101 is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 146
Rep Power: 9
Security101 is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Customer - Someone broke into my house this past weekend while I was off on vacation and I was not notified. The neighbors said that the siren was sounding, but I did not receive a call from the monitoring station.
First (as you are discussing two different customers in your post) with this one you need to determine why she wasn't called - bad phone #'s, connection through cable modem or other non-reliable mode, she didn't answer, central has no record of an alarm?

Was the police called?

Then go after that issue and solve it. Your contract should have the correct dialog to protect you from such a rare issue.


Quote:
I explained to her that her phone company had disconnected the phones to the alarm panel from the IP box (and plugged her cordless phone directly to it) she claimed she would sue them. They also told her this would not affect her alarm system.
This issue can be expected with any comm's besides POTS and/or cellular back-up. As a dealer you should always have one or the other for liability issues like this.

That being said, many customers are going to this method of communications for their phone service and we have to always try to sell them on alternative's like cellular. Most cable, VOIP, or other digital phone systems installers just don't really understand what we need to have happen for line seizure.

Monthly tests (or more frequent) are great but may not show an issue - besides the one described (where the RJ was removed from the modem) - especially if it's just poor quality Internet issues, or loss of power issues. For example we tested an account connected through Comcast with daily tests - 30% of the signals did not make it - but the others did. Those are scary odds and it's the reason traditional alarm co's aren't using them as primary comm's without a back-up, myself included...

Oh, and besides the fact that your contracts need to be clear - the digital providers also state clearly (but ever so quietly) that their services will not (or may not) support line seizure or alarm communications!

Just FYI

Jim
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-30-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
Steve Dale's Avatar
Steve Dale Steve Dale is offline
Educator
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia and Florida
Posts: 369
Rep Power: 11
Steve Dale is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by colsec_tech View Post
Customer calls to complain:

Customer - Someone broke into my house this past weekend while I was off on vacation and I was not notified. The neighbors said that the siren was sounding, but I did not receive a call from the monitoring station.

I would like to hear some of your thought out answers to this question. I had one lady claim that she was going to sue us for her stolen property, then when I explained to her that her phone company had disconnected the phones to the alarm panel from the IP box (and plugged her cordless phone directly to it) she claimed she would sue them. They also told her this would not affect her alarm system. Don't you just love the ongoing love between the alarm company and the telephone company?
Carl asked a very good question... Do you have a monthly test set up? If you did you could be liable if you did not take action to a missed test signal. If you have monthly test and then you never received this test signal from a scheduled monthly test and you took no corrective action such as calling the customer and asking them to test their system then you may have exposed yourself to some liability. Also, you have no idea who disconnected the RJ31X jack and direct connected the phone. So your claim that the phone company did it is hearsay and it could have been one of your technician or someone else. Surly the phone company will deny that they had anything to do with it. I personally would never set up monthly test unless I made sure that some responsible individual from my company will be checking these reports and calling the subscriber if they aren't received and thus testing their system immediately.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-30-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
Security101's Avatar
Security101 Security101 is offline
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 146
Rep Power: 9
Security101 is on a distinguished road
Default

Excellent point's Steve...

Jim
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-12-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
kingofslackerz kingofslackerz is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 1
Rep Power: 0
kingofslackerz is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Security101 View Post
the digital providers also state clearly (but ever so quietly) that their services will not (or may not) support line seizure or alarm communications!
Which is crap because all the VOIP's I've setup comm's on have worked fine. If the installer would install a modular jack RJ-11, I would have no problem installing line seizure. And it's not hard to install it even if they only have a telco cord coming out of the modem. I'm just not that comfortable with cutting someone's phone cord and having splices laying around. Especially when the modem is in someone's living room.

Business installs are the worst, the Phone Co. Installers don't do jack
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-13-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
Steve Dale's Avatar
Steve Dale Steve Dale is offline
Educator
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Georgia and Florida
Posts: 369
Rep Power: 11
Steve Dale is on a distinguished road
Default

I have VOIP (Vonage) and the dial tone provided works fine with the security system's line seizure. I used a RJ31X jack interface series in right off the 66 block. Not that I needed to use a RJ31X but old habits are hard to break.

My standard voice line security contracts read:

13. TRANSMISSION LINES:
You will pay for all telephone charges including any installation fee for a special jack to connect the system to your telephone service. We recommend that the system be connected to your telephone service on a special jack (RJ31X or equivalent) which will give the system priority over other telephone equipment in your home. The system includes an activator that sends signals to our monitoring station over your regular telephone service and if your telephone is out of order, placed on suspension or otherwise not working, a signal cannot be transmitted and we will not know of the telephone service problem. When the system is activated, you will not be able to use the telephone in your home to make other calls. Therefore, you may choose to have the system placed on a separate telephone line at your expense.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 09-15-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
DennisM DennisM is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Macon, Ga.
Posts: 6
Rep Power: 0
DennisM is on a distinguished road
Default

I set all my accounts up on daily test, the monitoring station I use doesn’t charge me for them. I have an office person check them daily and if I get 3 in a row I call the customer. It works for us and we are able to catch things like that faster.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 09-15-2009 - Monitoring and our obligation - Security, Alarm Systems - Voltage Talk forum
Sparky49's Avatar
Sparky49 Sparky49 is offline
Chief Moderator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 431
Rep Power: 11
Sparky49 has a spectacular aura aboutSparky49 has a spectacular aura about
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by DennisM View Post
... the monitoring station I use doesn’t charge me for them.
Lucky!
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


The time now is 07:27 AM.